Discussion:
musicians and their sound
(too old to reply)
George's Pro Sound Co.
2010-12-22 15:47:27 UTC
Permalink
Please note this is a rant with lots of generalizations and sweeping
statment that clearly do not apply to EVERY SINGLE musicians that has ever
graced me with their presence

I really think musicians really don't care what they sound like they put so
little effort into know how to use the tools they need to use to sound good.
they(mostly) unable to say any thing except"cool" or "sounds like shit"
they seem to be unable to hear even huge diffrences in microphone selection.
They go out of their way to snub all helpful advice they are offered as to
better get a decent sound going on
They spend 200$ on a guitar strap with their name but screw up their set
when the battery in their preamp goes dead after 3 songs!!
yes I am ranting but it seems that Musicians really need to take more
resposibility for communicating to us sound guys as to how we can best help
them
George
Jenn
2010-12-22 16:28:16 UTC
Permalink
In article
Post by George's Pro Sound Co.
Please note this is a rant with lots of generalizations and sweeping
statment that clearly do not apply to EVERY SINGLE musicians that has ever
graced me with their presence
I really think musicians really don't care what they sound like they put so
little effort into know how to use the tools they need to use to sound good.
they(mostly) unable to say any thing except"cool" or "sounds like shit"
they seem to be unable to hear even huge diffrences in microphone selection.
They go out of their way to snub all helpful advice they are offered as to
better get a decent sound going on
They spend 200$ on a guitar strap with their name but screw up their set
when the battery in their preamp goes dead after 3 songs!!
yes I am ranting but it seems that Musicians really need to take more
resposibility for communicating to us sound guys as to how we can best help
them
George
Generalizations, indeed.
--
www.jennifermartinmusic.com
Steve Hawkins
2010-12-22 17:13:00 UTC
Permalink
Post by George's Pro Sound Co.
Please note this is a rant with lots of generalizations and sweeping
statment that clearly do not apply to EVERY SINGLE musicians that has
ever graced me with their presence
I really think musicians really don't care what they sound like they
put so little effort into know how to use the tools they need to use
to sound good. they(mostly) unable to say any thing except"cool" or
"sounds like shit" they seem to be unable to hear even huge diffrences
in microphone selection. They go out of their way to snub all helpful
advice they are offered as to better get a decent sound going on
They spend 200$ on a guitar strap with their name but screw up their
set when the battery in their preamp goes dead after 3 songs!!
yes I am ranting but it seems that Musicians really need to take more
resposibility for communicating to us sound guys as to how we can
best help them
George
heh, I work both sides of the microphone and can understand your
frustrations.

From the musician viewpoint, we run into more bad live sound situations
than good, we begin to no longer trust the sound guy and consign
ourselves to whatever the end result is. I always go into a soundcheck,
if I get one, with an open mind and hope for the best.

From the sound guy side of things, I usually have no problem with the
folks I work with, however, I have had a couple of well known artists who
were difficult to work with. One who would barely talk to me, refused a
soundcheck and expected me to still get everything right. Needless to
say, their first tune was the soundcheck.

Another show I had three performers, the first two guys worked with me
and we got a great sound. The last guy wouldn't work with me at all and
had me EQ his guitar until he was satisfied with the tone. It sounded
like crap, but he was happy as a clam. When he played his set I started
getting dirty looks from people in the crowd who thought it was my fault
that he sounded so bad compared to the earlier players.

Damned if you do, damned if you don't. :-)

Steve Hawkins
--
My CD "Finger Painting" can be ordered from:

Me at - stephen DOT hawkins5 AT frontier DOT com

or through CD Baby (credit cards, international)

http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/hawkinssteve
George's Pro Sound Co.
2010-12-22 20:02:02 UTC
Permalink
Post by Steve Hawkins
Post by George's Pro Sound Co.
Please note this is a rant with lots of generalizations and sweeping
statment that clearly do not apply to EVERY SINGLE musicians that has
ever graced me with their presence
I really think musicians really don't care what they sound like they
put so little effort into know how to use the tools they need to use
to sound good. they(mostly) unable to say any thing except"cool" or
"sounds like shit" they seem to be unable to hear even huge diffrences
in microphone selection. They go out of their way to snub all helpful
advice they are offered as to better get a decent sound going on
They spend 200$ on a guitar strap with their name but screw up their
set when the battery in their preamp goes dead after 3 songs!!
yes I am ranting but it seems that Musicians really need to take more
resposibility for communicating to us sound guys as to how we can
best help them
George
heh, I work both sides of the microphone and can understand your
frustrations.
From the musician viewpoint, we run into more bad live sound situations
than good, we begin to no longer trust the sound guy and consign
ourselves to whatever the end result is. I always go into a soundcheck,
if I get one, with an open mind and hope for the best.
From the sound guy side of things, I usually have no problem with the
folks I work with, however, I have had a couple of well known artists who
were difficult to work with. One who would barely talk to me, refused a
soundcheck and expected me to still get everything right. Needless to
say, their first tune was the soundcheck.
Another show I had three performers, the first two guys worked with me
and we got a great sound. The last guy wouldn't work with me at all and
had me EQ his guitar until he was satisfied with the tone. It sounded
like crap, but he was happy as a clam. When he played his set I started
getting dirty looks from people in the crowd who thought it was my fault
that he sounded so bad compared to the earlier players.
Damned if you do, damned if you don't. :-)
Steve Hawkins
--
Me at - stephen DOT hawkins5 AT frontier DOT com
or through CD Baby (credit cards, international)
http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/hawkinssteve
you mean you have "artists" who actually are on site and ready for a useful
soundcheck before the doors are open?
I get maybe 2 or 3 a year
"most" walk in during the last song or two of the opening act
and excpect that the magic sound goddess have by intuition gotten the 6
monitors mixes perfect to their taste ,oh and has a "spare" guitar cord and
stand cause after 20 years of performing, it did not yet dawn on them to
carry their own
Steve Hawkins
2010-12-22 20:25:49 UTC
Permalink
Post by George's Pro Sound Co.
Post by Steve Hawkins
Post by George's Pro Sound Co.
Please note this is a rant with lots of generalizations and sweeping
statment that clearly do not apply to EVERY SINGLE musicians that
has ever graced me with their presence
I really think musicians really don't care what they sound like they
put so little effort into know how to use the tools they need to use
to sound good. they(mostly) unable to say any thing except"cool" or
"sounds like shit" they seem to be unable to hear even huge
diffrences in microphone selection. They go out of their way to snub
all helpful advice they are offered as to better get a decent sound
going on They spend 200$ on a guitar strap with their name but screw
up their set when the battery in their preamp goes dead after 3
songs!! yes I am ranting but it seems that Musicians really need to
take more resposibility for communicating to us sound guys as to
how we can best help them
George
heh, I work both sides of the microphone and can understand your
frustrations.
From the musician viewpoint, we run into more bad live sound
situations than good, we begin to no longer trust the sound guy and
consign ourselves to whatever the end result is. I always go into a
soundcheck, if I get one, with an open mind and hope for the best.
From the sound guy side of things, I usually have no problem with the
folks I work with, however, I have had a couple of well known artists
who were difficult to work with. One who would barely talk to me,
refused a soundcheck and expected me to still get everything right.
Needless to say, their first tune was the soundcheck.
Another show I had three performers, the first two guys worked with
me and we got a great sound. The last guy wouldn't work with me at
all and had me EQ his guitar until he was satisfied with the tone.
It sounded like crap, but he was happy as a clam. When he played his
set I started getting dirty looks from people in the crowd who
thought it was my fault that he sounded so bad compared to the
earlier players.
Damned if you do, damned if you don't. :-)
Steve Hawkins
--
Me at - stephen DOT hawkins5 AT frontier DOT com
or through CD Baby (credit cards, international)
http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/hawkinssteve
you mean you have "artists" who actually are on site and ready for a
useful soundcheck before the doors are open?
I get maybe 2 or 3 a year
"most" walk in during the last song or two of the opening act
and excpect that the magic sound goddess have by intuition gotten the
6 monitors mixes perfect to their taste ,oh and has a "spare" guitar
cord and stand cause after 20 years of performing, it did not yet dawn
on them to carry their own
I'm usually working for the same Promoter/Producer, he makes sure
everyone is there for soundcheck. Of course, "soundcheck" quickly
devolves into rehearsal, at which point I leave everything on and go to
dinner. :-)

I've been asked for cables and always pack a Baggs PADI with the DI's,
but I haven't run across someone asking for a stand yet. I also have
folks who bring their own mics. Say, is the Magic Sound Goddess a
Babe???

Steve Hawkins
--
My CD "Finger Painting" can be ordered from:

Me at - stephen DOT hawkins5 AT frontier DOT com

or through CD Baby (credit cards, international)

http://www.cdbaby.com/cd/hawkinssteve
p***@nospam.us
2010-12-22 23:32:31 UTC
Permalink
On Wed, 22 Dec 2010 10:47:27 -0500, "George's Pro Sound Co."
Post by George's Pro Sound Co.
Please note this is a rant with lots of generalizations and sweeping
statment that clearly do not apply to EVERY SINGLE musicians that has ever
graced me with their presence
I really think musicians really don't care what they sound like they put so
little effort into know how to use the tools they need to use to sound good.
they(mostly) unable to say any thing except"cool" or "sounds like shit"
they seem to be unable to hear even huge diffrences in microphone selection.
They go out of their way to snub all helpful advice they are offered as to
better get a decent sound going on
They spend 200$ on a guitar strap with their name but screw up their set
when the battery in their preamp goes dead after 3 songs!!
yes I am ranting but it seems that Musicians really need to take more
resposibility for communicating to us sound guys as to how we can best help
them
George
Bad gig, eh? I play both sides of the board, as you know. I am not
as expert as you on the engineer side, also as you know. I am never
surprised at what musicians think or don't think. On the other hand,
I've been an asshole on stage, too. I tend to think I was justified,
but I'm sure not everyone involved agrees.

For the record, I don't have a guitar strap with my name on it, but I
do have a tooled leather and custom dyed dobro strap with my name on
it that the maker insisted on giving to me. I would not be so
churlish as to not accept the wonderful gift in the spirit it was
offered.

To be fair, batteries are not "everyday thought" items. If it's
working, it's working. Binary. I carry extra batteries all the time,
regardless of which side of the board I'm on. I've been in bands
where whenever something went wrong, people complained to me and
expected me to fix it.

George, I live in anticipation of when you are running sound for one
of my gigs. That would be too cool for school. Plus, I'd learn
something.

And by the way, thanks for all the advice and help you've given me
over the years! Come on down to Austin one of these years!

Al
George's Pro Sound Co.
2010-12-22 23:38:29 UTC
Permalink
Post by p***@nospam.us
On Wed, 22 Dec 2010 10:47:27 -0500, "George's Pro Sound Co."
Post by George's Pro Sound Co.
Please note this is a rant with lots of generalizations and sweeping
statment that clearly do not apply to EVERY SINGLE musicians that has ever
graced me with their presence
I really think musicians really don't care what they sound like they put so
little effort into know how to use the tools they need to use to sound good.
they(mostly) unable to say any thing except"cool" or "sounds like shit"
they seem to be unable to hear even huge diffrences in microphone selection.
They go out of their way to snub all helpful advice they are offered as to
better get a decent sound going on
They spend 200$ on a guitar strap with their name but screw up their set
when the battery in their preamp goes dead after 3 songs!!
yes I am ranting but it seems that Musicians really need to take more
resposibility for communicating to us sound guys as to how we can best help
them
George
Bad gig, eh? I play both sides of the board, as you know. I am not
as expert as you on the engineer side, also as you know. I am never
surprised at what musicians think or don't think. On the other hand,
I've been an asshole on stage, too. I tend to think I was justified,
but I'm sure not everyone involved agrees.
For the record, I don't have a guitar strap with my name on it, but I
do have a tooled leather and custom dyed dobro strap with my name on
it that the maker insisted on giving to me. I would not be so
churlish as to not accept the wonderful gift in the spirit it was
offered.
To be fair, batteries are not "everyday thought" items. If it's
working, it's working. Binary. I carry extra batteries all the time,
regardless of which side of the board I'm on. I've been in bands
where whenever something went wrong, people complained to me and
expected me to fix it.
George, I live in anticipation of when you are running sound for one
of my gigs. That would be too cool for school. Plus, I'd learn
something.
And by the way, thanks for all the advice and help you've given me
over the years! Come on down to Austin one of these years!
Al
Al I just move 50 miles south,( from Syracuse to ithaca) so I am on my way
:-)
p***@nospam.us
2010-12-22 23:40:59 UTC
Permalink
So you should be here in 200 years or so...

I'll wait as long as I can!

Al


On Wed, 22 Dec 2010 18:38:29 -0500, "George's Pro Sound Co."
Post by George's Pro Sound Co.
Post by p***@nospam.us
On Wed, 22 Dec 2010 10:47:27 -0500, "George's Pro Sound Co."
Post by George's Pro Sound Co.
Please note this is a rant with lots of generalizations and sweeping
statment that clearly do not apply to EVERY SINGLE musicians that has ever
graced me with their presence
I really think musicians really don't care what they sound like they put so
little effort into know how to use the tools they need to use to sound good.
they(mostly) unable to say any thing except"cool" or "sounds like shit"
they seem to be unable to hear even huge diffrences in microphone selection.
They go out of their way to snub all helpful advice they are offered as to
better get a decent sound going on
They spend 200$ on a guitar strap with their name but screw up their set
when the battery in their preamp goes dead after 3 songs!!
yes I am ranting but it seems that Musicians really need to take more
resposibility for communicating to us sound guys as to how we can best help
them
George
Bad gig, eh? I play both sides of the board, as you know. I am not
as expert as you on the engineer side, also as you know. I am never
surprised at what musicians think or don't think. On the other hand,
I've been an asshole on stage, too. I tend to think I was justified,
but I'm sure not everyone involved agrees.
For the record, I don't have a guitar strap with my name on it, but I
do have a tooled leather and custom dyed dobro strap with my name on
it that the maker insisted on giving to me. I would not be so
churlish as to not accept the wonderful gift in the spirit it was
offered.
To be fair, batteries are not "everyday thought" items. If it's
working, it's working. Binary. I carry extra batteries all the time,
regardless of which side of the board I'm on. I've been in bands
where whenever something went wrong, people complained to me and
expected me to fix it.
George, I live in anticipation of when you are running sound for one
of my gigs. That would be too cool for school. Plus, I'd learn
something.
And by the way, thanks for all the advice and help you've given me
over the years! Come on down to Austin one of these years!
Al
Al I just move 50 miles south,( from Syracuse to ithaca) so I am on my way
:-)
hank alrich
2010-12-22 23:57:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by p***@nospam.us
To be fair, batteries are not "everyday thought" items. If it's
working, it's working.
That's one of the reasons I won't have a battery in my acoustic
instruments. I either have to make it an item of everyday thought or
suffer the consequences, because when it quits working, it's not
working.

I already have enough shots at making a fool of myself. No need to
invite disaster.
--
shut up and play your guitar * http://hankalrich.com/
http://armadillomusicproductions.com/who'slistening.html
http://www.sonicbids.com/HankandShaidriAlrichwithDougHarman
Mike Brown
2010-12-23 03:21:08 UTC
Permalink
Post by hank alrich
Post by p***@nospam.us
To be fair, batteries are not "everyday thought" items. If it's
working, it's working.
That's one of the reasons I won't have a battery in my acoustic
instruments. I either have to make it an item of everyday thought or
suffer the consequences, because when it quits working, it's not
working.
I already have enough shots at making a fool of myself. No need to
invite disaster.
I don't like batteries in my acoustics at all.

That's the first reason that I found PUTW and K&K so interesting.

Then I found out how good they are.

MJRB
George's Pro Sound Co.
2010-12-23 12:13:44 UTC
Permalink
Post by Mike Brown
Post by hank alrich
Post by p***@nospam.us
To be fair, batteries are not "everyday thought" items. If it's
working, it's working.
That's one of the reasons I won't have a battery in my acoustic
instruments. I either have to make it an item of everyday thought or
suffer the consequences, because when it quits working, it's not
working.
I already have enough shots at making a fool of myself. No need to
invite disaster.
I don't like batteries in my acoustics at all.
That's the first reason that I found PUTW and K&K so interesting.
Then I found out how good they are.
MJRB
and for me , in regards to sound equipment, anything that uses a battery
gets a new battery every use
no exceptions
George
p***@yahoo.com
2010-12-23 15:06:52 UTC
Permalink
On Thu, 23 Dec 2010 07:13:44 -0500, "George's Pro Sound Co."
Post by George's Pro Sound Co.
Post by Mike Brown
Post by hank alrich
Post by p***@nospam.us
To be fair, batteries are not "everyday thought" items. If it's
working, it's working.
That's one of the reasons I won't have a battery in my acoustic
instruments. I either have to make it an item of everyday thought or
suffer the consequences, because when it quits working, it's not
working.
I already have enough shots at making a fool of myself. No need to
invite disaster.
I don't like batteries in my acoustics at all.
That's the first reason that I found PUTW and K&K so interesting.
Then I found out how good they are.
MJRB
and for me , in regards to sound equipment, anything that uses a battery
gets a new battery every use
no exceptions
George
I used to play a lot with an ancient wah-wah which had no external
electric input so it had to be driven by batteries (a Coloursound - so
cheap it was tasty). Two gigs max, always a spare battery in the
bag....along with the pliers, screwdrivers...I used to take so much
shit to gigs I might as well have been a repair man.

Now - guitars, amp, lead, picks.

Pete

hank alrich
2010-12-22 23:46:35 UTC
Permalink
Post by George's Pro Sound Co.
Please note this is a rant with lots of generalizations and sweeping
statment that clearly do not apply to EVERY SINGLE musicians that has ever
graced me with their presence
I really think musicians really don't care what they sound like they put so
little effort into know how to use the tools they need to use to sound good.
they(mostly) unable to say any thing except"cool" or "sounds like shit"
they seem to be unable to hear even huge diffrences in microphone selection.
They go out of their way to snub all helpful advice they are offered as to
better get a decent sound going on
They spend 200$ on a guitar strap with their name but screw up their set
when the battery in their preamp goes dead after 3 songs!!
yes I am ranting but it seems that Musicians really need to take more
resposibility for communicating to us sound guys as to how we can best help
them
George
Yep - plenty of this has been around for a long time.

There's a whole category of PIG - Proudly Ignorant Guitarist
--
shut up and play your guitar * http://hankalrich.com/
http://armadillomusicproductions.com/who'slistening.html
http://www.sonicbids.com/HankandShaidriAlrichwithDougHarman
p***@yahoo.com
2010-12-23 00:47:47 UTC
Permalink
Post by hank alrich
Post by George's Pro Sound Co.
Please note this is a rant with lots of generalizations and sweeping
statment that clearly do not apply to EVERY SINGLE musicians that has ever
graced me with their presence
I really think musicians really don't care what they sound like they put so
little effort into know how to use the tools they need to use to sound good.
they(mostly) unable to say any thing except"cool" or "sounds like shit"
they seem to be unable to hear even huge diffrences in microphone selection.
They go out of their way to snub all helpful advice they are offered as to
better get a decent sound going on
They spend 200$ on a guitar strap with their name but screw up their set
when the battery in their preamp goes dead after 3 songs!!
yes I am ranting but it seems that Musicians really need to take more
resposibility for communicating to us sound guys as to how we can best help
them
George
Yep - plenty of this has been around for a long time.
There's a whole category of PIG - Proudly Ignorant Guitarist
I always do the same routine onstage - get the tone right and then
turn up the amp enough to get a bit of sustain for electric gigs. For
acoustic gigs I have the undersaddle pup set up really low so it won't
feed back unless the P.A. guy drives the whole rig really loud.

I always go for the tone (which certainly means for electric gigs I am
quite loud onstage) but what goes into or out of the P.A. is somebody
else's business. I know what sound I want to get - how it gets
projected I haven't a clue about and I never ask the sound people for
anything. I am not going to be sitting in the audience, after all.

Pete (The sound people often ask me for things, though - usually
turn_it_down......:-)
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